MovieChat Forums > L'eclisse (1962) Discussion > The end and the whole

The end and the whole


Here is my theory about the end. It may not be original (I have not studied interpretations of the film) but I hope it may serve as a starting point for further discussions.

I think the film is about two kinds of eclipse. One being the threat of nuclear war and the other emotional emptiness. Vittoria is lost after her break up and can't fall in love again. She lives in an eclipse. I see the last 7 minutes as a picture of her inner self. She is empty. But every eclipse is just temporary. The sun always comes out in the end, as we see in the last frame, where the streetlamp is like the sun. Vittoria is finally out of her darkness and can connect again.

Well, that's my take on it. How do you understand the end?


- This comment is most likely authentic and fairly close to what I intended to say -

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I think that your theory is very good.
I didn t understand this movie before I read ur theory.

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I think the ending is far too ominous and I think you have Vittoria's fate totally wrong. Shortly before the finale there's an introspective shot of her (which ones aren't introspective?;)) in which you get the sense that she feels that her new relationship is over. I think the last we see of her she's walking away alone. The ending is pure nihilism, it puts the entire rest of the movie in a new context - it trivializes all that went before. None of what we have seen is important in any way shape or form. The water barrel, that was earlier so important to these two people is presented at it truly is - an entirely insignificant piece of metal.

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I agree, except for

it puts the entire rest of the movie in a new context - it trivializes all that went before.

Everything in the film is a build-up to the ending. The end is the result of everything that proceeded.

And the film is not just about nihilism, it is also about the end of nature - industrialization, materialism, consumerism obliterating rural/natural landscapes.


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I disagree with TemporaryOne in the fact that I don't believe Vittoria's story had anything to do with the ending. To me, the finale represents the enormity of the world, that this little love story we have just been put through ultimately means nothing in the big picture. Yes, we've just seen a break-up and then another failed relationship- but Antonioni asks, "so what?". In the final sequence, he shows us a number of other people inhibiting the same setting whom we have never seen before- what about their stories?

I believe the ending toys with the idea of such a tight, specific narrative and shows the irrelevance of such a story. Hundreds of thousands of people go through similar situations every day. As the great George Harrison once put it, "life flows on within you and without you".

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Antonioni said the movie had a happy ending because Vittoria refused to re-live the tragedy of the beginning.

She meets Piero, they have some fun, and then they go separate ways again because they realize they don't suit each other anyway. That's the idea of the modern world Antonioni propagates: Casual dating and sex, changing partners, on-and-off relationships. People are free of outmoded traditions, moralistic and religious obligations. Remember the opening dialog from L'Avventura: "That guy will never marry you." - "Right now I don't want to marry him!" Worlds collide.

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Yes, I think the last shot of Vittoria reflected something positive going on within her, rather than nihilistic.

She is seen against the trees, in a "natural" setting. I felt, as I watched her face, she had come to some sort of returning to the self, of making a choice of some kind, a reclaiming of power. I don't recall whether the wind was blowing the trees or not; it would be interesting if they were still... the symbolism being, by making this choice she is not allowing fate to blow her around like a piece of paper (to paraphrase a poster above), but taking charge of her own mind, and life. Knowing what she wants, and doesn't want (as opposed to her constant refrain that so infuriated Piero: "I don't know!")

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I think you're right. And the wind seems to be an important element, probably signifying change. At the beginning of the movie, the fan blows through the room, but only Vittoria is affected by it. She is the one who wants to break up and move on, while he (Ricardo) wants to keep the status quo.

With her and Piero, however, NEITHER seems willing to commit themselves and neither shows up in the final scene. Two strong individuals with too different personalities. In his last scene, he's smiling as the wind blows through his office. In her last scene, the same wind blows through the trees and her hair. She smiles and moves on, out of the movie, and they never meet again. It's what they BOTH chose, otherwise one of them would have shown up.

It's really not an unhappy ending at all. Unless Antonioni was trying to say that the movie's Cold War theme, the permanent threat of nuclear annihilation, made the characters act like they did. That love cannot flourish and last under these circumstances.

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[deleted]

The final 7 minute montage meant nothing. It was just michelangelo saying to the world "look at me! i'm an artist!"



http://most-underrated-movies.blogspot.com/

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But the final light coming from a mad-made "réverbère" (street lamp) makes me think that our salvation, or our doom, will come from technology, and that our sun is now our LCD screens. The final scene, to me, reflects the fact that our cities, our streets, our daily commute, will surround us, eat us, and eventually replace the sun. And then, this will be the end.

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The final image of the starkly glowing lantern somehow managed to remind me about the certain hell raising suitcase in Kiss Me Deadly... and the nuclear paranoia was introduced earlier in the film via newspaper headlines etc. I´m not sure, however, if such an apocalyptically menacing interpretation of final image would be an ideal fit for a film like this though. The eerie alienation presses down on Rome... but atomic devastation? A bit too hard-core.



"facts are stupid things" - Ronald Reagan

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The end is one of the best in film history. Antonioni is 40 years ahead of his time. The eclipse is temprary but love doesn'tlast. They dont' meet as they had agreed to. Where are they?

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This has to be one of the best discussions on IMDb. There are so many interesting theories here!


- No animal was hurt during the making of this burger -

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Scorsese explains: http://youtu.be/0d0eFv1vHxo?t=3m34s




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Imo part of the difficulty in talking about the ending and what it means is that the thematic is much more important in Antonioni, as compared to simple narrative. For example, compare the ending of La Notte, the immediately preceding film. We see Giovanni and Lidia together, alone. Left with their existential anxiety and the specific concern of their relationship, whether they still have one, whether they still love each other. What is the role of love, the purpose of it, in the face of this generalized anxiety over life's meaning and purpose? As the film ends, Giovanni seems intent on making love to Lidia, right there in the sand trap. Do they? The camera pans away before we find out the answer. In short, the themes are more significant than the question what actually happened to the lovers.

The question to what extent the relation between Piero and Vittoria is central to L'Eclisse I think must be first addressed before we can understand how that relationship "relates" to the ending. We do not for example see them even have their first conversation until the film is nearly half over. We certainly see each of them apart far more than together. This leads us to feel there is a certain detachment in their relationship. Is this also true of them as individuals? To some extent this feeds into the perception noted above that perhaps the title of the film relates in part to a lacking, a diminution, of what "shines" in each of them, and their ability to relate is blocked (by something, but what?). Detachment in the relationship leading to a detached view of the characters from each other and their environments? I will return to this.

back to love and the relationship. Yet I don't think we are to conclude the film is saying something nihilistic, such as that romantic love has no purpose, or cannot survive at al in contemporary society. After all Antonioni is a truthful and not manipulative director. He mad this film during his love affair with Vitti after all, and later was married for 25 years, apparently happily so.

In fact when we last see Piero and Vittoria together, they are happy, or at least seem to be. Playing with each other, enjoying each other's company - if the film ended there, we would have a sort of classic happy ending. But it does not. And however one may choose not to see the ending as tragedy in the specific narrative, or as an expression of nihilism on the thematic, it is not, quite clearly, an unambiguous happy ending no matter how one slices it.

A singular feature of the film's narrative treatment of love involves the recognition that Vittoria's first meeting with Piero literally occurs in the very same day that her relationship with Riccardo ends. She moves from one to the other, without more than a couple of hours break (not that she immediately is in a relationship with Piero so much as that she gets no break after leaving Riccardo before Piero is in her life). How does one maintain perspective? Does the earlier relationship blend into the next?

Add the foregoing to Antonioni's use of doubling in various ways to subvert the viewer's expectations at the same time he explores themes by comparing characters and situations. How is Vittoria different, or the same, with the two men?

The "death" of her relationship with Riccardo is soon coupled with another death, this time not directly involving Piero, but through once again a doubling mechanism, that of the driver who steals Piero's car. A man dies in Piero's car, but it is not Piero. Not Riccardo, either, but yet a man dies. For what reason? Intention seems not to be present - it was no doubt an accident resulting from the driver's extreme inebriation.

The death foreshadows another "death" in the film, during the scene in the EUR, I think the second time Piero and Vittoria walk through it, when they part. The scene ends when Vittoria turns again to look at Piero walk away, and he has already disappeared. Does this absence from the scene in turn foreshadow the film's ending?

Another parallelism that is not the same as the doubling of characters obviously exists in the choice of meetingplace, with the water barrel and construction site. Earlier they meet at the scene of Piero's car being retrieved from the lake. Interestingly the earlier meetings both occur without any indication they had agreed to do so, yet are not indicated as occuring by chance. In other words we believe they had agreed to meet beforhand, but we are merely not shown them making such plans. Yet they agree to meet in the film's last evening at a specific time and place. Yet they do not.

Or is any of that really true? Is it not possible that the meeting at the crash site occurred by chance? With both drawn to it by the events unfolding there? Of course it is possible. Even the meeting at the water barrel may have occurred by chance, although concededly that is less plausible than that Piero and Vittoria would have been drawn to the recovery of Piero's car.

As for the ending of L'Eclisse, I recall reading an explanation of it that hinges on the specific time of 8pm, the appointed time to meet, and the date on which the events occur. In short, it would have been well into twilight, even darkness, by 8pm in Rome on such day. Perhaps then the film merely ends before they in fact do meet?

This analysis suggests that there is no unambiguous answer to the questions concerning the narrative course of the relationship between Piero and Vittoria. In turn this then raises the question whether such treatment is intended to leave it to the viewer to supply their own interpretation? Or alternatively is Antonioni saying what happens to them is not important enough to attempt to resolve in a film's ending? That something else is more significant?

Before attempting to answer that question, the ambiguity I think also undermines any attempt to conclusively speak to the if you will moral nature of their relationship, or whether Vittoria "should" love Piero, or instead choose to not see him, to end their relationship. In part this is also too problematic in light of the fact that we are not shown Piero arriving at the meeting place, but no Vittoria. How given their last scene together would they both decide, simultaneously, to end it, and for different reasons at that? (In fact and speaking as a man I see nothing in the portrayal of Piero that would suggest he would suddenly lose interest in such an attractive woman as Vittoria. It does not make sense.) It is simply too mundane and trite to think the ending means that both decided their relationship was not worth pursuing. (I think this recognition is very much supported by the film's opening. Although we understand quite clearly that Vittoria is unhappy in her relationship with Riccardo, the actual reasons why they end is not, at least overtly, even touched upon. They merely end. Whether they "should" have ended is not even begun to be addressed. It is not the point.)

And if that is the case, such understanding would tend to undermine any thematic conclusions regarding the value and meaning of modern love. But only tend to - I will return to this.

Before that, perhaps now is the time to address other specific elements contained in the ending. Returning to the element of doubling,there is of course the image of a blonde woman seen from behind we first expect to be Vittoria, but it is not. This is foreshadowed by an early scene when Piero first goes to Vittoria's apartment, a woman is in a dark light seen exiting the building, we first think is Vittoria, but it is not. Anoether element is that, as in other parts of the film, people who we wonder what role they have in the narrative are shown but then our expectation is subverted when the meaning of their presence is NOT shown to advance the narrative. This first occurs when the first person other than Riccardo and Vittoria is shown, that being a small boy crossing in front of them as they walk in the morning. Later there are other people included, but to little apparent purpose, at least in advancing the narrative. How else can one view this but that they have a thematic purpose, and not a narrative one? The boy for example shows not only that there are in fact other people in this film (if you had any wonder on first viewing!), but he is also totally unconcerned with them, and of course by extension with their "problems". And in the end as well, characters appear, we expect to a purpose, but then they again seem to have no connection to the narrative.

But also noteworthy is that just as unexplained characters appear, they disappear. That same boy in the begining never again appears. But it is not only those unrelated to the narrative, but also those that are, starting with Riccardo, who relatively disappears quite early. The characters in the end appear, but also "disappear".

Add up all of the foregoing, and it should be obvious that the purpose of the ending is not to advance the narrative. It is a mistake to see it as speaking unambiguously to the question of where Piero and Vittoria's love is going. It is even mistaken to see it as speaking to them individually in any sense. In fact one can say that the narrative "ended" before the ending. The end in fact does not advance the narrative.

But the film does not end, obviously, when the narrative does.

I will return to the specifics of the end in a future post, but hope this helps understand what I think the ending is not about.

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Following up on the preceding post, and attempting to squarely address the OP's question, I did want to first address Scorcese's commentary on L'Eclisse and its ending. One thing he says that is of great value is that understanding what is NOT shown is as important, or even more so, than what is. Brilliant, and I hope to incorporate that in my own observations. But I obviously disagree that we must necessarily conclude that the ending means there will be no meeting of Vittoria and Piero, and that the relationship has in fact ended.

My previous post I believe has correctly identified L'Eclisse as a film where the thematic is primary over the narrative, and that in fact the core narrative of the film has ended before the end. The end therefore is a kind of summary, not advancing the narrative but focusing on the themes covered.

Summary is a useful word in particular when one considers it is likely, and in my view persuasive, that Antonioni did not seek to make some single point in the film, or even necessarily to have a unifying, single theme or concept. So does a summary refer often (given the subject matter, of course) to a sort of listing, or review, of items or elements previously addressed. What then are the main themes that have been covered? To what extent are they addressed in the end?

Man in the Landscape. One of the interesting things about L'Eclisse is how Antonioni includes both interiors and exteriors - on the face of it nothing remarkable about that! But it is the way he mixes them that is remarkable. The film begins in an apartment, the living room of Riccardo, and we then see as Vittoria opens the drapes a rather bizarre site, that being the tower of the EUR looming behind her. The comfortable bourgeois trappings of the living room, the material reality of the protagonist's soon to be discarded lover, are soon left behind as Vittoria heads out into at first a seemingly empty of humans landscape. A heavy suggestion of absence in turn as a reference to death arises. While not literally a dead landscape, of course neither is the desert setting in Zabriskie Point, where the lovers specifically contemplate the extent to which a desert is, and in fact is not, "dead".

More significantly, the landscape is shown as in effect an avenue of transit for the characters. The landscape has an intrinsic condition, but is also a means by which through time the characters move from one interior or other landscape, to another. Vittoria boards an airplane, journeys to Verona, eventually enters the bar at the airport, leaves, and not shown on the return flight to Rome, is implied to have done so (obviously). Eventually we see Piero and Vittoria meeting, usually outside (where did they meet when they went to Piero's parents' apartment? Or for their last meeting shown, in Piero's offices?). Such meetings are followed not by showing them together, inside, but of them separated.

I think the meaning here is that the landscape may have a state of existence that is indifferent to the hopes, intentions, actions, desires of the people who move through it, but also "permits" people to do all those things within them.

Note that while L'Eclisse for most of its length, from the beginning, contains mostly interior shots with the outdoor scenes serving a transitional purpose, also in advancing the narrative in addition to containing and addressing the film's themes, the end is entirely shot outdoors. This is a cue to how there will be no more advancement of the narrative, focused on interior events. But it also more than that.

Antonioni uses final scenes set in a landscape rather than an interior rather often. (Can't think right now of a film that ends "inside".) L'Avventura ends as it pointedly moves from an interior set where Claudia discovers her lover's infidelity to a wandering outside as they ponder the meaning of it. La Notte ends with the married couple alone on a golf course, pondering their future. Blow-up ends as the photographer is first shown in a park's open field, retrieving a mimed tennis ball, and then himself disappeared. This is intentional as a pattern. It is meant to suggest that we are to consider the context of the film previously seen as occurring within a larger world that is indifferent to our existence.

Doubling. The doublings that we see throughout L'Eclisse continue into its ending. The blonde woman seen from behind we expect to be Vittoria was foreshadowed by the woman leaving her apartment building the first evening of the narrative. a reference to topical news, the potential of nuclear annihilation, is refernced by the newspaper carried by the older man. An earlier shot of airplanes flying high overhead, again an implicit reference to war, is doubled by a similar reference, pointed out by a man to a woman on the roof of a building. Transit through the landscape is referenced by a bus carrying people home. But parallels to interiors are pointedly not "doubled" in the ending.

Role of Love, and the Love Affair. If it is conceded that the narrative of the love affair between Piero and Vittoria is not advanced in the ending, does that mean it, and the question of love in general, has no part of it, either? I don't think so. Going back to Scorcese's observation, what are we to make of the lack of presence by either or both of them in the ending? I think it has something to do with the connection, described by John Updike and others of course, between sex, the erotic, and not death itself so much as that it replaces anxiety over death with an experience that suggests, provides glimpse of, the transcendent, the divine, the transformative possibilities of life itself. No lovers are in the ending, not them in particular, or others. THere are people, including the couple on the roof - are they lovers? I think we are not meant to see any of the people primarily as references to sex.

So, in this semi-urban landscape, love is not so much absent (just as life in the desert in Zabriskie Point is not really absent), as it is not examined. One could easily conclude from this that Antonioni is saying romantic love is not an answer to whatever challenge, or question, is presented in examining the landscape. There may be something to that. But I don't think that is the same as saying love has no purpose, and should be viewed as no answer to nihilism. Again, the people shown probably to some extent are lovers, who love someone else, are loved by others. No, I think the end by the absence of Piero and Vittoria refers to them, and their love, but much as it does not advance their narrative, it does not draw unambiguous conclusions from or about them.

As noted yesterday their affair has a detached quality, and is examined in a detached way for the most part. The ending "detaches" from their affair rather conclusively. Among other things I think this means that the ending is primarily NOT about their love story. What then is it about?

Eclipses, Shadows, Shrouds, Light and Dark. Thematically and despite decided elements of ambiguity in L'Eclisse, the choice of title, not to mention the several references to it and various meanings of it, metaphorically and as a practical occurrence, is relatively clear in respect of what this film is about. In an astronomical eclipse a dark body passes in front of a light one, blocking out that light, but only temporarily and even only partially. It is in short a dynamic process, briefly seeming to extinguish a light source, but in fact only preventing us from seeing that light.

Applying this notion, this process which may serve as metaphor, to this film, what is the light in question, and what may be blocking it? Several possibilities might serve as answers.

First of all, light is often a metaphor for awareness. Something or someone "sheds light" on something else is a way of describing increasing awareness. But how does the end provide any understanding of this?

The end takes place during advancing twilight. By the end it is nearly dark, and the streetlights come on, with a single one the film's last vision, brightly lit. But of course such light is no literal answer to the preceding question. Still, I think there is something at work here.

The ending is not the only nighttime outside shot in the film. There is the scene that takes place outside Vittoria's apartment building. There is the latter scene beginning in Vittoria's apartment with Rita and Marta, one shot from her apartment to the higher one where the three women together are, followed by the search for the dog, outside in the darkness. But also where there is enough light not only to see the dogs, but the row of wavering poles that so transfixes Vittoria. There is also the encounter between Piero and a woman who is strongly implied has served as a casual sex partner for him. In all cases the nature of darkness and how it affects what occurs in the scenes is not explicitly addressed, and yet in hindsight the darkness does affect what occurs.

Hiding in darkness, Vittoria can see Riccardo, outside but lit by some indirect street or other outdoor light(s). The dark seems to facilitate the drunk's ability to not be seen stealing Piero's car before Piero sees him driving it, already having stolen it. Vittoria first seems to hear the poles moving before she sees them, and the half light in which they move alters their appearance, making them seem magical. The darkness in Piero's meeting with the other woman has a more metaphorical purpose. Their encounter is in public, but the darkness renders them anonymous to passers by, and certainly does not occur inside, before others who would know them. It makes the encounter seem intended to be hidden.

Darkness also is involved in several other scenes, where Antonioni employs forms of shrouds. There is the shroud Vittoria holds before her while sitting on her bed while talking of her previous night with Riccardo. We briefly cannot see her face, her expression, as she refers to the night with him. But then we can, as she seems to dismiss the encounter, and by extension Riccardo himself and her relationship with him. Later she holds a translucent white curtain before her during her last encounter with Piero. While we can still see her through the curtain, it does tend to render her expression less clear as we seek to understand her emotions and intentions.

What then do these dynamics, these eclipses, mean? Much as the landscape themes show, light itself is indifferent, but allows those who can see, who choose to see, what is seen. In total darkness Vittoria would have still heard the poles, but would not have seen them, and not know what they were. Yet the halflight, the partial eclipse, not only allows her to see them, but also gave them a beauty that probably would not have "been there" in daylight.

Many commentators address the skeptical view Antonioni seems to have of modern civilization and its existential effect on us. With war, the threat of death, tied into such civilizatino in its peculiarly tranformed way. Such a theme does fit with the eclipse metaphor. Piero's materialism seems to block an understanding between Vittoria and him. Many rightly note that Vittoria is the only character who expresses a lack of connection to a materialistic relation to the world and life.

But if the eclipse metaphor is followed, should not civilization's blocking of real love and understanding pass, at least potentially? Following the metaphor would seem to in fact require such an understanding.

The same is true of the landscape. Darkness comes, but so does the dawn. Darkness is falling during the end, but a light created by man lights up the darkness. To be clear I am not saying the ending is optimistic so much as realistic - darkness, shrouding, eclipses, are not permanent. They are transient.

A few loose ends. Water flowing from the oil drum references the dynamic of change over time. Eventually the water within runs out. Permanance, the unchanging cycles, exist with transience always present. The landscape suggests permanence, but construction of the building will alter it. The haphazard collection of stacked building materials themselves suggest buildings, and one day will be part of a building or buildings.

People come and go, death is alluded to, but the landscape is neither death nor the absence of death, never entirely either people in love nor the absence of love. People themselves love, but are also transient, and love of the one can be and often is transient, even if love itself always exists.

i think that is what the end is about. It is a summary of the themes of the film, as noted above.

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