Well.. what a masterpiece right? Too bad there wasnt any threads about it.
Anyway all great, but the ending has (of course) a symbolism that is beyond me..
What was supposed to happen? Just a menage a trois? Viridiana accepted her total change and finally became a sex object ?
Or there is something deeper in the final scene? Another comment for society/religion/morality that i didnt get it . TALK PEOPLE!!
Yeah, I think Viridiana caved into reality and grudgingly accepted her status as a thing of pleasure of Jorge. I particularly liked how Jorge bribed the beggar into saving her by killing her attacker; we would all like to believe that in such a situation we could appeal to a person's sense of morality for help, but in the real world, you sometimes have to stoop to bribery and corruption to get things done. The "Last Supper" parody was brilliant.
Unfortunately, I'm not sure if there is a good VHS copy out there. The one I rented was patchy at best, with a chalky picture quality and scratchy sound. They really need to restore this on DVD.
BTW, anyone know the title of that song played at the end? ("Shake your cares away." How appropriate!)
What would have happened if the servant woman wasnt there with Jorge?
I would have enjoyed that...
Well, Ramona has become not the woman but the sentimental/sexual partner of Jorge so it's quite logic that she's there playing cards with both of them.
You say you'd have enjoyed it but think that almost all Buñuel psychological references are concerned about the theory of failed acts (la teoría de los actos fallidos), so Viridiana can't get any sexual contact with Jorge (despite she does want it, that's enough clear in the movie, isn't it?)
Saludos!
The original ending that Bunuel wrote for the film was that of Viridiana going to Jorge's bedroom and finding him alone. She goes in and that's the end. The Spanish government backing the film demanded the scene be removed because of the sexual implications, so Bunuel re-wrote it to show the three of them playing cards. Bunuel ended up liking the new scene better because he felt it covertly implied an eventual maenage-a-trois.
shareActually, the original ending had Viridiana entering Jorge's room and getting in bed with him and Ramona. This was apparently the only scene to which Franco's censorship team objected, and it was thus taken out. The current ending does indeed imply the original menage a trois that Bunuel wanted to depict.
share"Am I the only one who found the ending really depressing?"
Viridiana is one of the most depressing films I have ever seen, and I mean that as a compliment.
guys, criterion is releasing Viridiana in a couple of weeks! check their website for more info...
shareJust saw the criterion on a nice rear projection setup, having never seen the film before. Pretty pretty cool, although it was disarmingly provincial until the first gasp-inducing act (which I won't give away, it involves Viridiana's coffee) about 20 minutes in. From then on its a nice, twisted picture.
Anyone who says this film is an affront to Christianity or the church is thinking too hard. Sure, she was training to be a nun, but that's where the connection ends. The person who acts in a way to offend anyone is Rey and the band of merry pranksters V lets in.
Bunuel's dolly shots are nice: the one down the hall that ends on the clock face, there are a few.
And I do cherish the film mostly because what I see as allegorical about humanity in it. How if you leave us to our own devices, however nice we are, we will destroy. So maybe something's guiding us, maybe guilt, maybe 'the Man'.
Whoo, boy! Let me get me razor blades and sleeping pills ready, It's too bad gas ovens have all those safety features built into 'em these days.
shareThe ending is anything but depressing, in fact it is the happiest possible ending for a Bunuel film. She has given up an irrational religion in order to be with the man she loves, a choice that Bunuel would of course approve of. Her moral decline is shown as a good thing in this film, whether you agree with Bunuel's hatred of the catholic Church is up to you but his intention was almost certainly to show it as a ridiculous thinhg.
shareI don't think it's an optimistic ending. I certainly don't think she loves Jorge. It's not there anywhere in the film. And Viridiana didn't decline morally in the film, it's just that despite being a pious and well-meaning girl, her acts of charity such as being kind to that sick guy who was treated like crap, was ultimately twisted and thrown right back on her face. It's actually a twin film to 'Nazarin' where despite Fr. Nazario's best intentions of trying to help people as much as possible, he leads it into chaos and anger.
I personally think that pigeon-holing these films as simply anti-clerical is too easy a way to look at it. And in any case consider the aspects of Christianity represented in these movies. Both the character in 'Nazarin' and 'Virdiana' aren't evangelicals looking for converts. They represent the best qualities of Catholic Christianity. And those qualities such as helping the poor, tending to those in need are also secular ideals. So essentially Bunuel's message is pretty well anti-utopian. In fact I read somewhere that some communist groups were offended at the portrayal of peasants in the film since it's against that group.
How much is a good nights sleep worth?
"If she were truly religious she wouldn't have let that failure hinder her and continue on. She was being falsely pious"
Ah, the "No True Scotsman" fallacy. Contrary to your (fallacious) assertion, Viridiana WAS "truly" religious and redefining your terms on the fly doesn't make the movie any less anti-religion.
Yes, there was no suggestion of love.
I enjoy most Bunuel movies but this one really disturbs me and it's even worse to see how a lot of people seem to take more notice of a menage a trois than the rape scenes.
In the end Viridiana is forced to accept the existence of real world and therefore ends up playing 'The Tute'.
sharei think the ending was supposed to symbolize how she gave up on religion.
I think that when jorge says " i always knew i could get my cousin to play cards" i felt that it almost meant that he knew he could get her to stop being religious. When i think of "playing cards" i think of gambling, and when i think of gamblers i think of sinners.
So i know its only my interpretation but i felt that this scene was important to show how Virdiana lost her faith in god.
What you've said totally makes sense and it's backed up by the scene where Viridiana looks at herself in the mirror.
shareI thought the ending implied Viridiana had failed again, even in her most spent state. She finally sees what she is to others, or at least to Jorge. She checks her appearance in the mirror, then goes to his room to presumably give herself up to him... only to find him alone with the now preened maid, with whom he seems happy. He does not care that she sees them together. I think the card scene is showing that he is comfortable with the way things are now; the maid is his partner and Viridiana is simply his cousin - he no longer wants her in the same way he once did. She has again, and finally, failed even in the attempt to voluntarily have sex with Jorge. The scene, and film, ends with him saying he once thought "My cousin Viridiana and I will end up shuffling the deck together", whereas earlier in the film he states in a argument with his girlfriend that "she is not my cousin". Well, now she is.
shareIn my opinion it's pretty much clear how the metaphor of "playing cards" stands for "having sex". There are phallic objects everywhere (candle-holders, the lamp placed exactly between the two women), and the final situation is an obvious reference to the fact that Jorge owns the complete power over the two women, and he will lead both of them to menage-a-trois, as their sexual objects.
Well, Bunuel's symbolism is most of all about sex, hypocrisy (expecially Spanish people's one during Franco's regime), and human powerlessness towards the course of the events. In "Viridiana" there are tons of sexual hints (apart from the obvious ones) all along the movie: for example Viridiana's inability to milk the cow (she clearly wants to explore her sexuality, but she's still kept away from it by the hypocrisy of her duty to become a nun), or the very disturbing hint to a possible pedophiliac abuse of Jaime on Rita, the child; I don't know how it exactly would sound in English, I've only seen the version with Italian dubbing, but the sentence at issue it's something like "Uncle Jaime likes it when I play under the tree". We also see a long shot of the child's feet , a hint to Jaime's fetishist obsession with feet.
P.S: irisrx, i also like your interpretation of the final scene, even if it goes in a completely different way from the meaning I gave to it.
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I didn't understand where the film was going for about the first 30 minutes, in fact I think the movie only really started around the time Viridiana and Jorge left the bums alone and they just wrecked the place, and got drunk and proved that you should never help the poor, never help the hungry, never help anybody, because they're all ungrateful pigs.
Whatever the ending stood for, it was just another brilliant take on society and how things work in life. I also saw a lot of similarities between this and Simon of the Desert. Both films were about how the poor are ungrateful and careless, and how a pious person can be tempted into the dark side of life. Ironically, it is Silvia Panal who is tempted into the change in Viridiana, while in Simon of the Desert she is the one doing the tempting. Both brilliant works of art. Wow.
To my opnion Brunuel is just showing the thin line between the choice of
living for your (or "a" for that matter) religon or not.
Viridiana has a good character, clean and not spoiled by reality.
This makes here sadely enough very infantil. She left the big house
alone with all the poor beggars. When the cat leaves the house, the mice will
dance. (dutch saying).
When she leaves the Convent, for the visit that is, she is confronted
with real life. And shocked about it. At a certain moment she has no
idea what to do. Although she pretends to have made the choice not going
back to the convent again. When Mother comes to visit her the Mother tries
to persuade her to come back. In which she does not succeed.
This bit is perhaps very short in the film but I think also very important.
The Mother does not even ask about her feelings, what all happend.
Why is this ? Maybe this is the way Brunuel shows us what he thinks of
Christianity ?
For sure, to my opnion, Viridiana has not realy changed. She is lost. She has
no idea what to do next. And so she complies to play cards.
Or perhaps, as stated, a menage a trois, which was not agreed with coz
of Franco. Also as stated above.
What happened after the end is left open to your own interpretation. But most people agrees that Viridiana ended having a relationship with his cousin Jorge, while at the same time Jorge keeps alive his affair with Ramona, the servant.
Then the possibilites are endless... threesome? Ménage à trois? everything is possible. The best thing is that like the wasted land in the property of Don Jaime, Viridiana finally will be "useful" in the best way possible, not useless anymore.
And did anyone notice the medicine in the cupboard with 'penetro' written on it?
shareNope...
"Just" a ménage à trois...
Under the Paving Stones, The Beach
I agree a lot with artihcus022. This is a film filled with spiritual themes. The character of Viridiana is representing our current state of our degrading spiritual state in the world. I clearly see the connection to the brilliant Nazarin also. It takes a lot of will power and spiritual strength to be an honest and true human being with faith. It is becoming harder and harder to maintain a faith as every day goes by with our civilizations growing hunger for material satisfaction.
As for Nazarin, Bunuel commented; "I am very much attrached to Nazarin. He is a priest. He could as well be a hairdresser or a waiter. What interests me about him is that he stands by his ideas, that these ideas are unacceptable to society at large, and that after his adventures with prostitutes, thieves and so forth, they lead him to being irrevocably damned by the prevailing social order." This reminds me of how Bunuel himself was struggling with his art.
Poor Viridiana , i feel sorry for her
Life is a dirty rat-race.
Nothing lasts Forever but the Earth and Sky
I felt bad for Ramona. I am surprised by the amount of people that expected that a ménage à trois. Personally I seen Ramona as Jorge's plaything, and that she would be cast aside for Viridiana. My interpretation is made sadder in the final scene where Romana's hands can be seen during the card shuffle; they fidget and seem uneasy, as though she knew her time with Jorge had come to an end.
sharethe ending was really was the icing on the cake of a wonderful movie, having seen his prior movies which were mostly surreal, the realism of this one really hit me hard
so many movies, so little time