MovieChat Forums > Psycho (1960) Discussion > Psycho and the "Saul Bass Mysteries"

Psycho and the "Saul Bass Mysteries"


In the vast collection of "on-set behind the scenes photos" of the making of Psycho, there are about two or three where Hitchcock is directing Anthony Perkins in the "clean-up of Cabin One" scene where a few grips and workmen are milling around between takes.

I looked at these photos for years before I looked at them again with a caption: "Hitchcock and Saul Bass on the set of Psycho." Bass -- mustachioed and laughing -- was, I thought, "just one of the grips" before I saw that caption. But then I found other pictures of Bass, and ...its him.

So, this: Saul Bass not only did the credits for Psycho, not only was "visual consultant" (credited a second time) for Psycho...he was on the set of Psycho, just hanging out.

But there are a couple of big "mysteries" involving Saul Bass and Hitchcock and Psycho. One of them is famous(if a bit hard to believe.) The other is perhaps less famous, so I will lead with it:

SAUL BASS MYSTERY ONE: Psycho was Hitchcock's biggest hit and a triumph for collaborator Saul Bass. So why did the two men NEVER work together again? Not even on a credit sequence?

I dunno. But I can guess a little.

Three great Hitchcock films in a row have Saul Bass credit sequences: Vertigo(1958), NXNW(1959) and Psycho(1960.) Each credit sequence is coupled with the requisite Bernard Herrmann credit score(Sumptious, exhilarating, nerve-wracking -- Vertigo, NXNW, Psycho) and thus these three great Hitchcock movies are great BEFORE Hitchcock starts doing his work in the three films(directing them.)

Hitchcock was, in a way, "jumping on the Saul Bass bandwagon" where other fifties filmmakers already were -- principally Otto Preminger , who had been using Bass credits AND poster logos since at least "The Man With the Golden Arm"(1955) and continuing on through with the famous logos for Anatomy of a Murder, Exodus, Advise and Consent, and In Harm's Way.

Hitchcock jumped off the Saul Bass bandwagon, but Otto kept Bass on board -- for posters at least -- I think all the way through Otto's last movie in the 70's.

I think perhaps Hitchcock didn't want to be too "locked in" with Bass. Indeed, of the three Hitchcock-Bass collaborations, only Vertigo had an authentic Saul Bass poster and logo. Hitchcock famously took the Psycho logo(that big slashed PSYCHO word), directly from the cover of Robert Bloch's book (artist Tony Palladino got the same cash as for his logo from Hitchcock as Bloch got for the book! $9000.) North by Northwest has a logo "in the Bass tradition" (the North and Northwest "Ns" get directional arrows) but I don't think Bass drew it; its too "movie studio art department" looking.

So Hitchcock used Bass for credits, but only once for posters.

And then Hitchcock did a very interesting thing: he hired Saul Bass to be a "special visual consultant" on Psycho...apart from the credits work(for which Bass got a separate credit.)

What did Saul Bass DO as the "special visual consultant" on Psycho?

Well, storyboards, for one, and there-in lies a tale.

Hitchcock told Truffaut, "Saul Bass only did one set of storyboards for me, but I didn't use them. He wanted to do something for the picture, so I let him lay out the storyboards of the detective's killing."

Hitchcock was quite insulting in this sentence, noting that he threw out Bass's Arbogast Murder storyboards(they made the detective look like a killer, not a victim climbing the stairs) and suggesting that "Bass wanted to do something for the picture" when Hitchcock HIRED him to do these things.

Hitchcock was also LYING in this sentence, because while the Saul Bass Arbogast murder storyboards have never been published-- SAUL BASS' SHOWER MURDER STORYBOARDS have been published.

They were published in the 70's in a film magazine, and Hitchcock was alive, and I wonder how he felt to have been caught in a lie -- it seems that Hitchcock just didn't want to give Bass credit for his contribution to the shower murder.

What else did Bass do as "Special Visual Consultant?" Well, Hitchcock DID give credit on this one: asked by Hitchcock to "do something" to make the Bates Mansion more sinister in its exterior shots, Bass experimented with a few approaches(some involving a model house) before settling on giving Hitchcock all sorts of "stock footage of rolling, roiling storm clouds" to matte into the sky behind the house.

And that's about it. What was Saul Bass' major contribution as "Special Visual Consultant"? Well, some storyboards(Just the two murders? Or other scenes?) Making the Bates Mansion sinister via some stock footage. And..hanging out with Hitchcock while he directed the Cabin One Clean-Up Scene. Hah.

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..and then Psycho is a monster blockbuster for Hitchcock...and indirectly for Saul Bass and...and...and...

They never work together again.

I wonder what happened?

I wonder if Hitchcock offered Bass credits and visual work on The Birds, and Bass turned him down?(Perhaps that movie with its effects challenges was just too daunting?)

I wonder if Bass expected to be hired for The Birds, and Hitchcock turned BASS down? (Hitchcock was in the 60's, an increasingly erratic and egotistic man -- he'd be not hiring Robert Burks, and firing Herrmann, and dissing Newman and Andrews, and firing some actor off of Topaz, and ruining Tippi Hedren...)

I can't solve this first "Saul Bass Mystery" but perhaps the solution lies in the SECOND Saul Bass Mystery

SAUL BASS MYSTERY NUMBER TWO: Who directed the shower scene?

Just as Hitchcock erred in saying that Bass "only drew storyboards for the detective's murder" in his interview with Truffaut, Bass in some other interview said that HE directed the shower scene, though he added the caveat that "Hitchcock was nearby, but let me do the actual work."

This created one of the few controversies attendant to Psycho, but it became a big one. Both Janet Leigh and Assistant Director Hilton Green took issue with Bass' contentions and said that Hitchcock -- and ONLY Hitchcock -- directed that famous scene.

I guess we should go with Leigh and Green -- but.....Leigh wasn't there EVERY DAY the scene was filmed. Perhaps Saul Bass filmed the body double work with Marli Renfro? And Green might have been protective of his boss.

We DO know that a more tired Hitchcock, 12 years later when working on Frenzy, had his assistant director direct a few scenes while Hitchcock napped nearby -- including many of the "detail shots" in the famous potato truck scene.


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And while being interviewed on the set of Family Plot, Hitchcock left the set for the day with instructions to an assistant to get a close-up of some car keys in a slot: "Fill the screen with those keys!" Pick-up shots and other shots with no actors in them (or no stars) often are directed by others, I think.

For his part, I think Saul Bass only responded once to the claims that he did not direct the shower scene: "Why do you think I got that Special Visual Consultant credit?"

Its a mystery, I tell you. One of a few in the Hitchcock career and the Psycho lore.

But it seems to me to be a BIG mystery.

Saul Bass worked with Otto Preminger for 20 years or so, many movies. Saul Bass worked with Hitchcock on just three years and only three films. (But three GREAT films.)

Why didn't it work out?

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Comparing Preminger (a notorious martinet, difficult character) to Hitchcock vis-a-vis Bass is interesting, but, of course, there are other datapoints, esp. Frankenheimer and Kubrick (Spartacus's credits are all-time great in the year of Psycho) for whom Bass did amazing work in the '60s.

I haven't been able to find any references but I *recall* interviews in which Frank. described falling out with Bass. I seem to remember him saying something like he was 'creeped out' or 'unnerved' by Bass being on set all the time, and even more explicitly something like 'He [Bass] needed to go off and make his own damn movie'. Note that on their final film together, Grand Prix (a big hit), Bass's credit was, “visual consultant; montages and titles by Saul Bass.”

For most people these days and I think most at the time it's Bass's credits and split-screen race montages that are GP's main attraction, but at least some critics hated them. Here's Kael:

"After the first few minutes of Grand Prix (MGM), my companion leaned over and said, 'Now you know what it's like to be run over.' Saul Bass had got hold of heavy tires and Cinerama: you don't go to this movie, it comes after you. And you're not rid of Bass after the titles, he keeps coming back with montages—little World's Fair–type documentaries, simple-minded and square, that pad out the three hours."
(this is from The New Republic 14 Jan 1967, not The New Yorker)

It can't be easy to have a subordinate/collaborator be such a lightning rod for both credit and blame.

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Comparing Preminger (a notorious martinet, difficult character) to Hitchcock vis-a-vis Bass is interesting, but, of course, there are other datapoints, esp. Frankenheimer and Kubrick (Spartacus's credits are all-time great in the year of Psycho) for whom Bass did amazing work in the '60s.

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I am reminded that Hollywood is but certainly was "a closed shop company town" in which surprisingly few key players often worked on a lot of movies. For instance, there was a time in the 70's, where your big movie scores were being done pretty much by John Williams, Jerry Goldsmith, or Elmer Bernstein; Oh, Lalo Schifrin snuck in there and Hitchcock used Ron Goodwin for Frenzy, but Williams, Goldsmith and Bernstein got the most play.

And for awhile in the fifties and sixties, everybody wanted and needed a Saul Bass poster and/or credit sequence.

In 1960, I think he does Psycho, Spartacus, and Ocean's eleven.

In 1962, he does Walk on the Wild Side (very celebrated.)

In 1963, Mad Mad World. (Credit sequence goes on FOREVER.)

And didn't Billy Wilder finally use Bass for One, Two Three and KIss me Stupid? (Some Like it Hot and The Apartment do NOT have Bass credits.)

That said, well, uh...its not like studios needed Bass credits on everything. He's not on Westerns like Rio Bravo and The Mag 7. I guess I'd have to see his credit list to get a sense of how many movies Saul Bass really did the credits on.

And this: somewhere around 1972, the Saul Bass credit sequence was pretty much OVER. Movies like The Godfather and The Exorcist DIDN'T HAVE credit sequences. Just the title would appear -- "The Godfather" -- and the movie would begin. Spielberg's Jaws had a pretty straightforward credits sequence(we're underwater chugging along from a shark's eye view); Close Encounters used the Godfather technique, and unlike the va-va-VOOM excitement of the North by Northwest credit sequence, Raiders of the Lost Ark opens almost boringly.



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Yes, the Mad Mad World credits were long (typical of big budget road show films) but quite inventive in the way the actors' credits compete with each other for top billing (just as the actors themselves will compete in looking for the money).

And I'll love the Raiders opening because of the way the Paramount logo mountain dissolves into the mountain in the film.

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Yes, the Mad Mad World credits were long (typical of big budget road show films) but quite inventive in the way the actors' credits compete with each other for top billing (just as the actors themselves will compete in looking for the money).

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Yep...a "hidden hand" keeps moving the names all around. Its definitely a fun credit sequence...but it sure is a long one, a movie unto itself.

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And I'll love the Raiders opening because of the way the Paramount logo mountain dissolves into the mountain in the film

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Yes, that was a nifty gimmick that kept repeating through the sequels -- the mountain was also a gong(Temple of Doom); a Monument Valley butte(Last Crusade) and a priarie dog mound (Crystal Skull.)

Its just that I found the actual opening sequence of Raiders -- all very quiet John Williams "mood music" as Indy is revealed and the group heads for the treasure trove -- to be the opposite of NXNW's big, giant "here comes a lollapalooza" opening credits.

Of course, in the second one, (Temple of Doom) opens with Kate Capshaw belting out a terrific "Anything Goes" in Mandarin Chinese(except the title) with a Busby Berkley dance number going. Go figure.

I can't remember how the other two open, credit music wise.

Note in passing: I always felt that Williams' stirring martial music for Spielberg's flop "1941"(1979) was a more exciting "American Anthem" than the "Indy/Raiders" theme, and I wish it had been the "Raiders" theme.

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I haven't been able to find any references but I *recall* interviews in which Frank. described falling out with Bass. I seem to remember him saying something like he was 'creeped out' or 'unnerved' by Bass being on set all the time,

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Maybe Hitchcock was, too (on the Cabin One clean-up set, for instance.)

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and even more explicitly something like 'He [Bass] needed to go off and make his own damn movie'.

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I would expect for "hands on" directors like Hitchcock and Frankenheimer, having a guy like Bass hanging around, making suggestions, etc WOULD bug them. At least with credits and movie posters, that's a concise task. "Just hanging around to kibbutz" can bug a director -- especially if the credit sequence seems not to be the director's work.

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Note that on their final film together, Grand Prix (a big hit), Bass's credit was, “visual consultant; montages and titles by Saul Bass.”

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Sounds like Bass learned well from what Hitchcock awarded him on Psycho. Hitchcock assistant Hilton Green noted, by the way, that he shares the "credit shot" with Bass in Psycho where Bass is listed as Visual Consultant; its as if Hitchcock wanted the two men to be equated as his assistants.

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For most people these days and I think most at the time it's Bass's credits and split-screen race montages that are GP's main attraction, but at least some critics hated them. Here's Kael:


"After the first few minutes of Grand Prix (MGM), my companion leaned over and said, 'Now you know what it's like to be run over.' Saul Bass had got hold of heavy tires and Cinerama: you don't go to this movie, it comes after you. And you're not rid of Bass after the titles, he keeps coming back with montages—little World's Fair–type documentaries, simple-minded and square, that pad out the three hours."
(this is from The New Republic 14 Jan 1967, not The New Yorker)

It can't be easy to have a subordinate/collaborator be such a lightning rod for both credit and blame.

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See..you can see Frankenheimer realizing that he had to give up "his" movie to make room for these Bass split screen interludes -- which, as I recall, took us right out of the movie as a dramatic story and made it look like an industrial training film or something.

I suppose Saul Bass, like a lot of "hot talent," had his day...and then stayed too long. But he kept doing posters -- The Shining(1980) has one -- and I think his last credit is "by Saul and Elaine Bass"(daughter? wife?) for the credits on Casino (1995.) Scorsese -- looking to revisit the past yet again.

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>>e: SAUL BASS MYSTERY ONE: Psycho was Hitchcock's biggest hit and a triumph for collaborator Saul Bass. So why did the two men NEVER work together again? Not even on a credit sequence?<<

Probably because of different ideas. Bass thought style was substance and he wanted to direct. Hitchcock was the master of suspense, good storyteller and had some tongue-in-cheek and black comedy humor. We saw that he put in the double entendres in Psycho. He was fastidious when it came to directing, types of cameras, and camera angles and placement. Also, Hitchcock was a perfectionist. When he got something in his head, then it became his way or the highway. If it wasn't that, then he was very demanding. You can even see it in AHP introductions and epilogue.

>>e: Hitchcock told Truffaut, "Saul Bass only did one set of storyboards for me, but I didn't use them. He wanted to do something for the picture, so I let him lay out the storyboards of the detective's killing."<<

I have to agree that Saul Bass did the Psycho shower scene storyboards, but AH directed. It's backed up by JL and his assistant director. I can't see him giving up that.

I haven't seen any Arbogast murder storyboards, but Bass did explain his vision to Hitchcock which was denied (see video). I have to agree with Hitchcock on this one because we didn't need more stylistic drama, but to show a brutal one. The camera and overhead shot was already in place. Arbogast was to be dispatched post haste. It's all part of making Loomis and Lila Crain become more of the protagonist while building up Norman Bates' mother as the villain. Up to this

http://mentalfloss.com/article/82274/artist-saul-bass-what-it-was-storyboard-psycho

(Bass didn't turn out to be a great director for films. He has all these cutting edge scenes, but they get boring after a while. See his Phase IV sci-fi film.)

I haven't seen it yet, but the movie to watch is Hitchcock (2012). It's about AH and his wife and the making of Psycho.

https://www.imdb.com/videoplayer/vi2501551129?ref_=ttvi_vi_imdb_4

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>>e: SAUL BASS MYSTERY ONE: Psycho was Hitchcock's biggest hit and a triumph for collaborator Saul Bass. So why did the two men NEVER work together again? Not even on a credit sequence?<<

Probably because of different ideas. Bass thought style was substance and he wanted to direct. Hitchcock was the master of suspense, good storyteller and had some tongue-in-cheek and black comedy humor. We saw that he put in the double entendres in Psycho. He was fastidious when it came to directing, types of cameras, and camera angles and placement. Also, Hitchcock was a perfectionist. When he got something in his head, then it became his way or the highway. If it wasn't that, then he was very demanding. You can even see it in AHP introductions and epilogue.

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As I discuss with swanstep above, it is likely that as "controlling" a director as Alfred Hitchcock would chafe at a collaborator messing with his vision. Hitchcock reportedly told one screenwriter who put in too many camera angles in a script "why are you trying to direct MY picture?" . Who knows, maybe Hitch was being correct when he said "Bass wanted to do something for the picture," maybe SAUL BASS asked Hitchcock, "can I collaborate with you on Psycho beyond the titles? Storyboards, atmosphere? I would love to learn at your feet."

I'm reminded here that we never REALLY know EXACTLY how a movie comes together. We have to figure that Hitchcock called Bass, or Bass called Hitchcock, and soon the collaboration was underway. Storyboards would be the easiest collaboration -- Hitchcock had other artists do them for other movies, why not hire Bass for this one? Hitchcock wanting to "make the house sinister" is exactly the extra "oomph" that a Hitchcock movie needs. That Psycho house never looked as mysterious again -- in its many TV and some other movie appearances -- than it does in Psycho.

But again, when it was all over, and Psycho was a hit...no more Hitchcock/Bass collaborations.




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Interesting to me:

After the three-in-a-row Bass credit sequences, we get these, from other people, I can't remember who they are:

The Birds: VERY Bass-like, as the flying, screeching birds literally tear the credit words apart to nothingness. No music...just those soon-to-be-famous forever bird shrieks(electronic.)

Marnie: What the HELL? One of those old-fashioned "book turning page" credit sequences out of a 1944 Irene Dunne picture. Coupled with Herrmann's rather melodramatic and old-fashioned score here, the Marnie credits feel like Hitchcock is "retreating from the modern." But the jokes on us -- this movie will have sexual content as jolting as the violence of Psycho.

Torn Curtain: Along with The Birds, the best of the post-Bass credit sequences. Herrmann has been fired but John Addison's credit music is pretty exciting and we get the flames of hell (a rocket engine) screen left , and shots of human beings in anguish(Newman, Andrews...all the victims and villains of the film) screen right. Exciting yet grim...just like Torn Curtain.

Topaz: The problem here is that the credits are over grainy stock footage of a Russian military parade. Jarre's martial overture is exciting, and the credits have a "modernistic fast pace," but that stock footage really ruins the effect.

Frenzy: The film was greatly praised for the long opening shot down the Thames, but the credits OVER that shot are pedestrian and get in the way(the attempt to put a PSYCHO-style FRENZY logo up front doesn't work, it feels slapped on.) I showed Frenzy to a female friend a few years ago and she said of the credit sequence: "You like this? This looks like a really cheapjack movie to me." I guess you had to be there in '72. I also blame Ron Goodwin's royal credit music -- the unused Henry Mancini version is MUCH better...regal yet sinister.

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Family Plot: Hitchcock goes The Godfather route -- almost. Only four credits up front: "Alfred Hitchccock's" "Family Plot" "Screenplay by Ernest Lehman," "Directed by Alfred Hitchcock" and -- we're into the story. Indeed, unlike with as other movies where the stars at least get separate title cards at the end, Dern, Black, Harris and Devane whoosh up on a scroll at the end as if they are featured players!

I mention the post-Bass credits because they are a reason the Big Three are so great -- and I think only with The Birds and Torn Curtain did Hitchcock match them.

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>>e: Hitchcock told Truffaut, "Saul Bass only did one set of storyboards for me, but I didn't use them. He wanted to do something for the picture, so I let him lay out the storyboards of the detective's killing."<<

I have to agree that Saul Bass did the Psycho shower scene storyboards, but AH directed. It's backed up by JL and his assistant director. I can't see him giving up that.

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One thing, I think, is that if you look at the Bass storyboards, they are "sort of" like the finished sequence on film, but not really -- Hitchcock added more detail, more shots, more brutality. And the climactic shot of Marion's dead face on the floor -- quite interesting in the Bass version -- doesn't at all match "the Hitchcock version."

Storyboards more often than not give the director a "blueprint" rather than detail for the action. Storyboards for car chases are really unable to get the effect.

And are not storyboards much like...comic book panels? Ah ha....

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I haven't seen any Arbogast murder storyboards,

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Nor I...I've always really had a craving, too. For one thing, I'll bet Arbogast doesn't look like Martin Balsam. But I assume those storyboards, rather than being preserved, were simply thrown away. Isn't that horrible, how screen history is ignored by its makers?

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but Bass did explain his vision to Hitchcock which was denied (see video). I have to agree with Hitchcock on this one because we didn't need more stylistic drama, but to show a brutal one. The camera and overhead shot was already in place. Up to this

http://mentalfloss.com/article/82274/artist-saul-bass-what-it-was-storyboard-psycho

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I couldn't get this to work for me. Is this where Bass says he wanted Arbogast's hand to knock out all the posts on the bannister falling backwards? I can see Hitchcock rejecting that idea because it doesn't make practical sense. No one COULD fall and do that -- but likely Bass wanted to help Hitchcock make the staircase fall even more of an action lollapalooza than it is in the finished movie.

I recall somebody saying they had the idea of putting the camera into a carved-out slot in a medicine ball to follow Arbogast down the stairs.

A lotta wild ideas!

But the finished product is a mix of "wild style"(the overhead shot, the process fall) and stark brutality(the slash to Arbo's face; the final finishing off on the foyer floor.) Hitchcock mixed the balance just right.

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Arbogast was to be dispatched post haste. It's all part of making Loomis and Lila Crain become more of the protagonist while building up Norman Bates' mother as the villain.

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Its been said that the sheer suddenness of Arbogast's exit is part of the structure AND the mood of Psycho...the detective gets all this screen time, all this build-up, all this possible heroism and -- ka-BOOM - just like that, he's outta the movie. Not to mention, its a repeat of how Janet Leigh suddenly was out too.

As some critic wrote when the Sam and Lila section begins, "The entire machinery of the basic story starts up again, as a couple investigate the disappearance of the investigator who was investigating the disappearance of Marion..."

Ha. Ha. Ha. Maybe Psycho IS a comedy. Just a little bit....

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(Bass didn't turn out to be a great director for films. He has all these cutting edge scenes, but they get boring after a while. See his Phase IV sci-fi film.)

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I haven't seen Phase IV, but I've read about it(ants?) and it doesn't seem to have connected with audiences at all. Perhaps his true calling was credits...and the other graphic arts such as those he used in advertising.

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I haven't seen it yet, but the movie to watch is Hitchcock (2012). It's about AH and his wife and the making of Psycho.

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I've seen it...and I can't say I'm a fan. About 1/3 of the film captures the import of what went down -- Hitchcock fighting his studio bosses to make a movie they thought was worthless, Hitchcock enjoying the impact of the shower scene on an audience for the first time...but the filmmakers are way too "sketchy" about the story(the Hitchcock family and estate allowed no clips from Psycho, nor re-staging of scenes, nor little use of the House)...and somebody made the decision to make Alma Hitchcock(Helen Mirren)the star of the movie. It is implied that "Alma did everything" (chose Perkins, chose Leigh, directed the Arbogast murder, re-wrote the ending) and Hitchcock was just a bystander.

I know an actor played Saul Bass...but for the life of me, I can't remember a scene with Saul Bass. I DO remember one with a briefly seen and heard Bernard Herrmann, but of course it is ALMA who recommends the music on the murder scenes.

They must have wanted Helen Mirren real bad to re-write the script so she's the star...

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