MovieChat Forums > Forbidden Planet (1958) Discussion > Why would communicating with base be so ...

Why would communicating with base be so difficult?

posted 10 years ago by hobnob53
18 replies | jump to latest

When Adams tells Morbius he has to contact Earth base to get new orders, he goes into great detail describing how difficult and time-consuming this process is -- all the steps necessary to build and power an adequate communications system. Later Quinn the engineer also goes through how much work he has to go through to build the system (even before the first attack that destroys some of the equipment, including his Clystron Monitor).

My question is, why would an interstellar spacecraft not have such equipment already built in as part of its infrastructure and ready to operate? Communications equipment would seem to be pretty basic stuff. Having to cannibalize the ship's other gear, build special housing for the core, use the ship's main drive to power it, and (in this case) rely on a handy robot to run off the necessary lead shielding, seems needlessly complicated and entails a lot of risks (in not being able to obtain the materials to construct the right system, etc.), not to mention that simply being able to readily contact base would seem to be a very basic requirement for a spacecraft on any mission.

[–] grizzledgeezer 10 years ago

Well, you have to short-circuit the continuum on a five-parsec basis. "Don'tcha see, Mathyew?"

You've answered your own question. The C-57D is a small ship, not the "space palaces" we're accustomed to from Star Trek. There's no room to set up all that equipment on a permanent basis.

[–] hobnob53 10 years ago

Well, you have to short-circuit the continuum on a five-parsec basis.

I know, I was trying to leave that part out to spare Cyril Hume's feelings.

You've answered your own question. The C-57D is a small ship, not the "space palaces" we're accustomed to from Star Trek. There's no room to set up all that equipment on a permanent basis.

Well, I didn't really answer my own question, since I made no reference to the size of the ship. Besides, since they seem to carry everything they need aboard the ship -- it's mainly a cumbersome matter of putting it all together -- size wouldn't appear to be the problem.

So why have a ship where this stuff isn't already installed and working? What if they needed to contact Earth base while in space, without a convenient planet, forbidden or otherwise, to land on to do the required assembly? What's so technically difficult about having a radio capable of contacting base that they have to strip the ship even of much of its own infrastructure? (Since Quinn has to steal various bits of gear from places all over the C-57D just to try to patch the thing together, even before the id's first attack, clearly this system wasn't simply something sitting in a box in the store room waiting to be unpacked and put together.)

Even from a plot point of view all this seems unnecessary. They could just as easily have had the system ready to operate and have the id destroy it anyway.

Three other points: of course, they already have a radio system installed in the ship, which we see Quinn operating during their approach, which they use to talk to Morbius. So why isn't this system adequate for contacting base? Radio is radio. An advanced technological society of the 23rd century should be able to replicate the fundamentals of 20th-century radio technology.

Second, how long would they have to wait for a reply from Earth base? (And does that term refer to Earth itself or just a forward base? I assume the latter.) Even if they have the equivalent of Trek's sub-space radio they might be there quite a while. Plenty of time for Morbius's id to vaporize the lot.

And last, how could Adams be sent off on such a mission without orders that covered the Belaraphon fatalities? If you're trying to find out what happened to a group of settlers missing for 20 years on a distant planet, one slightly obvious possibility is that they're all dead. And given the needlessly complicated procedures necessary to establish contact with base, you'd think they'd give the Commander the widest possible latitude to handle whatever situation he encountered.

"Don'tcha see, Mathyew?"

But thanks for the reference to Winchester '73. Great Jimmy Stewart impression! :) As Commander Adams might have said to Robby carrying the shielding, "The old man also taught you never to waste lead -- now you're short."

[–] grizzledgeezer 10 years ago

"Well, you have to short-circuit the continuum on a five-parsec basis."

I know, I was trying to leave that part out to spare Cyril Hume's feelings.

At least he implicitly acknowledges that radio transmission isn't instantaneous. Pseudo-scientific devices (such as sub-space radio and the ansbile) were created to get around the problem of the finite speed of light.

You're right, of course, about the Captain needing authority to make important decisions on the fly. In a Star Trek story I wrote, Kirk makes a critical decision without contacting Starfleet -- "If I didn’t have the authority to make major decisions, I never would have accepted a long-term mission."

"Don'tcha see, Mathyew?"

That's actually a reference to Gunsmoke.

[–] hobnob53 10 years ago

Pseudo-scientific devices (such as sub-space radio and the ansbile) were created to get around the problem of the finite speed of light.

As we all know. But in FP they had developed Hyper-Drive, "through which the speed of light was first achieved, and later greatly surpassed." So if they had invented a means of traveling faster than light, logically they should have applied the same principle to radio waves -- as of course happened with Trek's sub-space radio. And in fact we have no idea whether they have such a technology or not: the film is silent on this issue. But it's a fair assumption.

Sorry I didn't pick up on the Gunsmoke reference, but it's also (well, almost) a line from Winchester '73, right down to the enunciation of "Mathyew". Since I just saw that film again the other day it's the natural thing for me to have thought of.

Either way, I did see.

[–] Princerd 10 years ago

Radio waves have a finite speed and would never be of any use in long distance communication. A futuristic communications device would be one of complete imagination.

So, a communication device not being permanently installed on the ship is completely illogical. It is a plot device. The plot demanded a reason why the crew would be forced to remain on the planet regardless of danger, and the scriptwriter came up with this oddball reason.

It would have made more sense to blame the necessary delay on the lengthy time delay involved in long distance communications. Of course then you would not have Robbie "running up" a ridiculous amount of synthetic lead and carrying it around with one arm.

[–] hobnob53 10 years ago

Well, obviously it was a plot device, but as you point out, it's illogical to think they'd have no such communication equipment already installed and available.

In the film, Adams (Leslie Nielsen) says that "Just to construct a core to house the bunker would take ten days", to which Morbius replies, "Disabled here for ten days and nights" before offering Robby's services to provide the lead shielding. This implies that the main delay isn't communicating as such but erecting the housing for the equipment -- as though except for that ten days' construction delay communicating itself would be relatively quick. (And since Robby provided the shielding wouldn't they have been able to start communicating in a day or so?) The whole exchange doesn't really add up, other than as a way of keeping the crew stuck on the planet and to enable us to see some more of Robby's abilities.

[–] arbilab 10 years ago

Common lead would have crushed the vehicle sir. This is my morning's run of isotope 217. The whole thing hardly comes to ten tons.

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[–] ewaf58 10 years ago

The Federation had just put their line rental fees up so using their subspace stations were out of the question for a small underfunded ship.

[–] magolding 10 years ago

Why send a ship so small it couldn't have its communication equipment assembled and operating all the time, when one possibility was that they would find all the Bellerophon colonists alive (and perhaps with many kids), the Belleraphon unusable, and the colonists demanding to return to Earth for any of an almost infinite number of reasons?

Didn't anyone foresee the possibility of having to take many colonists back to Earth? Didn't they have any larger ships that would have had room for the colonists, and thus perhaps room for an assembled and ready-to-use communicator?

[–] ewaf58 10 years ago

Well it was a basically a military ship sent out on an initial investigation at high speed. Larger ships require more energy and this was probably intended as reconnaissance only.

Given the economics of space (even in the 23rd century) perhaps carrying all the equipment that might possibly bee needed was impractical. Remember the Apollo 13 astronauts had to improvise in order to make an emergency air purification system to remove C02.

However you've made some good points - my response is only a suggestion.

[–] magolding 9 years ago

If it was just a reconnaissance and didn't have room for the colonists, it might take another two years to get a larger ship to Altair IV. Maybe one year if they did what they did in the movie and temporarily disabled the ship to send a message. And what if the colonists had an emergency?

I guess their commanders figured that either the colonists were all dead by now or else they were fine but the Belleraphon had been lost in space while returning to Earth.

[–] ewaf58 9 years ago

This is why a prequel would be so good - seeing the jealousy of Morbius in action against his crew. I don't think I've ever been able to find a picture of the Bellerophon online.

The name itself is interesting as Bellerophon was the slayer of monsters in Greek mythology but here Morbius creates one and slaughters his crew.

[–] hifijohn 9 years ago

good point they can fly for 1 year at faster than the speed of light but simple radio communications is just beyond their technology??!!!

[–] hobnob53 9 years ago

Right. I mean, we launched the Pioneer probes in the 1970s and they're now leaving the solar system, yet still sending back data daily, years after their radios were supposed to go dead -- and those radios have the power of a 20-watt light bulb. Obviously for interstellar communications you indeed don't have to short-circuit the continuum on a five- or six-parsec basis.

[–] hifijohn 9 years ago

well maybe on a one or two at the most parsec but never on a five or six!

[–] hobnob53 9 years ago

Yes, are parsecs so plentiful that they can be so carelessly expended?

[–] hifijohn 9 years ago

as my father always told me -son, parsecs dont grow on trees.

[–] robert3750 9 years ago

The film gives the impression that "short circuiting the continuum on a five or six parsec level" requires essentially ALL of the power of the Hyperdrive. That means that having the equivalent communications ability on board would require TWO Hyperdrive engines. Not such an easy thing to do.