Was anyone surprised by the lack of a film score throughout the film? There's music at the beginning and the end and that's it! Was this intended as an homage to the early talkies and early gangster films like Little Caesar? Or was it John Huston's way of accentuating the realism and grittiness of the subject matter? Either way, it does add a starkness to the events. But one can understand how it could be off-putting to the casual viewer. Any ideas?
sharei think it made the really overbearing soundtrack in the final scene that much more impactful.
shareI had been watching this for quite some time before I noticed the lack of music. I didn't miss it one bit. Do any of us have a musical score playing along with everything we do? This was much better than the films with music constantly trying to manipulate the audience as though each viewer doesn't know what to "feel" about any particular scene. Music is too often an intrusion (major exception for the Blue Danube in 2001).
Don't ask a dyin' man ta lie his soul inta Hell
yeah, just like the music is an intrusion in the opera. get a clue.
shareDon't switch subjects to make yourself sound superior. I have more than a clue that opera is a different art form. I also don't complain about there being music included in films intended as "musicals."
Don't ask a dyin' man ta lie his soul inta Hell
I didn't notice the lack of musical background at first, but it did sure enhance the "real" feeling of the film.
I killed him for money and for a woman. I didn't get the money... and I didn't get the woman.
Great comeback!!
"OOO...I'M GON' TELL MAMA!"
I didn't mean to go over your head. I just find it bizarre that you're taking issue that music in movies make them seem heavy handed or "unrealistic." The last time I checked, camerawork and editing don't spontaneously outgrow from the bullets and blood of REAL CRIME. Film is a construct. Creative talent align information into ideas. Camera angle is information. Lighting is information. Audio is information- more relavantly, music is information.
Your "do any of us have a musical score playing along with everything we do?" is an interesting question, and facetiously I'll answer yes, because I have an ipod in my ear every second of the day. But honestly, I'll answer, no, and I'll ask a question of my own: "Should we abbrogate all film to some flimsy wasteland of social realism?" To which I'll answer no. It would be like playing a piano with only your left hand, and although I can empathize with those unfortunate artists who've had their right cut off or shot off or crushed off or offed in any variety of ways (the most dramatic of which to a social realist: ravaged by war), most pianists have two, and it would be a waste to only use one to make music. Unless, of course the other was used to donate sperm to one of the many unfortunate infertile couples-- there's something Romantic about this idea. This pianist analogy must be approached with caution, however- there are many great women pianists who use both their hands to make great art.
Manipulation is a heavy word to throw around. (It's five syllables long!)Keeping in mind the power imbalance it suggests, the viewer is the one with the clicker or the movie ticket or knife. The show can die anytime you feel it's too much. Manipulation is enjoyable, though. When I watch movies, I like to be pushed and pulled and twisted like putty. Sometimes I get so caught up with it I even manipulate myself!
As to the accusation that music in movies somehow activates the dumber side of the audience: the music in this movie certainly has made you all think! Although, it seems we've only been able to step a word and an exclamation point beyond the question mark, so this one is still up in the air.
Reeler, nice answer & good point.
Jabbapop, you didn't "go over" anyone's head. You just sounded incredibly arrogant to me.
I'd rather be arrogant than myopic!
shareCute - but I'm not myopic, so you're still just arrogant.
shareThe limited use of a musical score in this film is one of the things I always believed made it stand out. The robbery scene is so much more effective without music. The first time you watch this movie, you really don't know what's going to happen. The whole robbery sequence makes you feel like you're a part of the gang. The silence adds to the realism.
The Miklos Rosza score that is used in the beginning and end, meanwhile, is very good.
It's funny, but I'm sure a majority of people who see this movie are certainly rooting for these crooks. Dr. Irwin Reidenschneider and Dix Handley are likeable characters.
On the other hand, it always bothered me that Alonzo P. Emmerich took the easy way out. He deserved to rot for a while in prison. As for Cobby, I always felt bad for him. Yeah, he was a greedy rat, but it looked like he had a decent bookie business and it's unfortunate it was blown out of the water because a crooked attorney was greedier.
Doc, admittedly, dropped the ball as well by believing Emmerich's story of fencing the jewels himself. "Greed made me blind," Reidenschneider said.
I've seen this several times now and never miss the music. I honestly believe a musical score would have detracted from the drama of the film.
I'm the kind of guy, when I move - watch my smoke. But I'm gonna need some good clothes though.
Wow, I find this a truly closed minded idea. My friend, did you note that the film was in black & white? I might ask, are any of us living in a black & white world? My goodness, what an Exclusion on the part of the director! See my point?
Film is an art and like any art it's made up in ingredients put together by an artist. In the case of film, a master artist, the director, puts together the performances of other artists (actors, writers, cinematographers, lighting directors, set dressers, wardrobe specialists, and, yes, music composers). Like a good chef, an good artist chooses & adds his ingredients in proportion to the recipe that will give him/her the desired end product. For instance, garlic in a pizza pie is probably a wise choice; garlic in an apple pie probably not so appealing. Some directors choose classical music; some choose contemporary music (a practice, I personally, find an abomination, not because I do not find it an legitimate aesthetic choice, but simply because I find it a poor one as it dates any film--we can all pick out those films from the '70s that tried to be 'hip' by using a noodling rock organ for their soundtrack which does not sound so 'hip' today, merely annoying). Some even choose to not have any music at all eg Failsafe. In the case of TAJ, I think Huston's choice was bold & I think it works. The gritty reality he wanted was best left to the actors & the dialogue in this case.
However, in other cases, music is part & parcel of the art, and I'm not just talking about musicals. Can one imagine the Port Scene in Star Wars without John Williams' brass section beating out the drama like our own heartbeat with us? Or the Chariot Race in Ben Hur without Rosza's majestic fanfares welcoming us to Imperial Rome? Or the Shower Scene in Psycho with Bernard Herman's screeching violins accompanying Marion's screams? Yes, these choices were made to manipulate the viewer, but I would ask, what else is art but the manipulation of the observer's emotions & intellect through a medium? Whether looking at Michelangelo's David or watching Scosesee's Taxi Driver, the artist endeavors to manipulate into seeing the world in his way and we oblige him to the extent that he ingratiates us.
Film, indeed all art, is construct. If it was your intent to imply simply imply that Huston's intent in TAJ was to indulge in a gritty realism then I would agree, life goes unscored for the most part. But art is always manipulative & if your comments were meant as a generalization about film, then I must take exception to your woefully narrow definition of film as an art form that for some reason must be solely devoted to wasteland of banal realism when it is capable, demonstrably so, of so much more.
Respectfully.
Very good points.
shareMiklos Rozsa is such a great composer, the little bit of music that played in the movie was enough. That thundering track at the beginning pretty much set up the entire feel of the movie.
By the way, did anyone notice the similarity between that music and the one he did for The Killers?
This world is a comedy to those that think, a tragedy to those that feel.
Although the movie was made in 1950, it appeared to be made in the '30's; gangster subject matter and sparse score included. Not an expert, but I would guess it's part of the whole "noir" thing. I think it really did have that whole 1932 feel to it.
shareYeah, it's often listed on film noir lists along with Kubrick's THE KILLING, etc.
I'm the kind of guy, when I move - watch my smoke. But I'm gonna need some good clothes though.