MovieChat Forums > Kind Hearts and Coronets Discussion > Joan Greenwood and the London Lisp.

Joan Greenwood and the London Lisp.

posted 15 years ago by finnegansword
6 replies | jump to latest

Joan Greenwood was 26 when she played the part of Sybella in KIND HEARTS AND CORONETS. I have long been fascinated to know the origin of the so-called 'London Lisp' which she occasionally uses within the film. Many, many years ago I heard a partial explanation of this lisping phenomena - as I understand it, it was a late Victorian/Edwardian Upper-Class mode of speech intended to distinguish such children from their inferior suburban peers. In later life these children may have employed it to attract the attention of others of the opposite sex for whatever purpose. Sybella certainly knew how to employ it to advantage.

My question is: does anybody have better information as to its origins and how it came about? Could it, for example, have been a French Governess import that the privileged children picked up? I'm speculating.

I tried without success to Google the term and found only a computer language listed. If anyone has sound information on this linguistic quirk, I would be very interested to hear it. Idle speculators are NOT welcome.

[–] mkelly54 15 years ago

Actually, the use of the lisp and a rounding of vowels and consonants was common language used by UK royals throughout the 19th and early 20th Century. In the book, The Reason Why, a very detailed review of the Charge of Light Brigade, the author provides lengthy descriptions and examples of the "silly" talk of the royals.

Sentences like, "I wowwn't wowwy awout that" were so common that officers from other countries required translators when consulting with the British Military. Of course, after the fiasco the use of untrained royals in combat received heaps of rage and the high command was restructured. But not enough to save the British army in WWI.

Tho sowwy, old boy.

[–] Barbara-4 15 years ago

I love Greenwood's "lisp" and her voice in general.

The Brits weren't the only one to affect a silly lisp. I think most Royals did - although I'm thinking specifically of Spain.

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[–] CharlesTheBold 8 years ago

According to a history book I read, King Philip II had a lisp. According to legend everybody else imitated it, and that's why Castilian Spanish uses "th" for the s sound!

The English have a similar and even less credible legend -- southern Englishmen said that the Yorkish hero Hotspur had a speech impediment, and the other Yorkshireman imitated him, and that created the Yorkshire accent ( Shakespeare referred to this in Henry IV part 2).

People in the Renaissance didn't understand about accents and dialects.

[–] elena-28 8 years ago

Philip, or more likely, his father Charles, may or may not have had a lisp, but if that were the case, the letter "S" would probably also have been affected, which it is not.

Here are some observations on the so-called "Castilian lisp":
https://www.reddit.com/r/badhistory/comments/1ylfic/bad_historical_linguistics_the_origin_of_the/?st=iwqra15w&sh=16115ec4

[–] finnegansword 15 years ago

I can see from your responses that the lisping phenomena in England has been around much longer than I thought. Having watched THE CHARGE OF THE LIGHT BRIGADE quite recently, I noticed that one of the characters there who was one of the 'Gentlemen Travellers, (and a real person) was supposed to lisp, so this gets us back to the 1850's.

If anyone else has some thoughts on the 'London lisp,' do let's hear them!

[–] stevekaczynski 8 years ago

It may have been an affectation of the 19th century upper and upper middle class. Sibella does not really belong to that world but might alter her pronunciation to fit into it. George Orwell commented that 19th century upper class pronunciation sounded rather like the Cockney pronunciation of his time, and he gave Churchill's accent as an example (Churchill was born in 1874).

"Chicken soup - with a *beep* straw."