most movies from the 40s were b&w, regardless of genre.
the ending isn't dark really, considering the two remaining guys (the actual protagonists) manage to look "at the bright side" of things and can laugh about their wasted efforts, so it's not pessimistic at all.
with noir movies i'd associate urban settings, a detective, femmes fatales etc.
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BillySlater (4281)
5 years ago
Some Noir purists disregard non B&W movies being Noir because it doesn´t check that box. "Leave her to heaven" is an example of a 40´s movie in colour there is debate over because it has a femme fatale as well as other Noir elements but doesn´t tick the B&W box.
The protagonist dies and they lose all their gold. How is that not a dark ending despite how upbeat the remaining two were? The tone of the movie itself is pessimistic despite what you feel about the ending.
I think there are certainly enough Noir elements for it to be called a Noir and btw not every traditional Noir is a detective movie with a femme fatale in it. I also disagree, that Howard was a protagonist. Howard doesn´t show up until at least 20-30 minutes into the film. Dobbs is the main character up until his death. One could argue that Dobbs starts off as Protagonist and gradually descends into Antagonist hence the term "flawed hero".
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huwdj (4571)
5 years ago
Hang on, Laura in B&W - unless there is some horrid colourised version floating around - and Gene Tierney is not playing a femme fatale, rather an beautiful innocent who everyone falls in love with. But personally I wouldn't consider Laura a noir - more of a straightforward murder mystery.
Regarding Treasure, I've always thought of it as a later day western with none of the elements of a true noir.
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BillySlater (4281)
5 years ago
My bad, it was "Leave her to heaven". Edited to avoid confusion. And fyi Laura is considered a noir.
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huwdj (4571)
5 years ago
I guess not by me - but then again I'm not sure I could define what is and is not noir. I would say Laura lacks a couple of elements to make in noir, specifically a scheming femme fatale and an anti-hero type lead.
Perhaps noir is one of those things that you know it when you see it and is most easily recognizable with Bogart as the lead?
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MrFilmJunkie (909)
5 years ago
only because noir movies are usually b&w doesn't mean that all b&w movies are noir.
the tone is not pessimistic per se, there are dark elements as usual in thrillers, dramas, adventures for the sake of suspense and tension. and the ending is 100% optimistic (with a dark humorous flavor if you will).
i agree with dobbs starting off as the protagonist and descending into the antagonist.
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BillySlater (4281)
5 years ago
I never said all B&Ws are noir. I just meant that being a B&W film checks off another box that people usually need for a movie to be considered noir.
That´s the first time I´ve heard anyone say its a positive ending. I certainly would not call it a traditional "happy ending" or "100% optimistic". lol
So you agree with me it has dark elements? Almost the entire movie is about Dobbs´ gradual descent into paranoid madness. I wouldn´t call that typical for an adventure film or even a western.
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