Stupid Question #1 - re: DVD Recorders' image quality

How do the images look when you record a movie from TV?
That depends on a number of things, including the quality of the signal being fed into the TV, the quality of the TV tuner, the quality (and setting) of the analog to digital conversion etc. etc. etc. But in general it should look pretty much like it did when you watched it as it was recording.


What I mean is, is there much reduction in the image quality? Or is the difference negligible?
That depends on the source, the A/D conversion and what digital format is being used. If you're recording broadcast TV, which has a limited horizontal resolution compared to the studio, and record at full D-1 resolution, the reduction should be minimal. OTOH if your source id D-1 quality and you record using a VCD resolution, you're going to notice the loss.


And so, since technology has had almost 10 years to improve I was wondering if its time to consider another DVD recorder.
DVD technology has not improved. It's been replaced by HDTV, UHD, 4K etc.

Thanks very much




"Stick with me, baby, and you'll be fartin' thru silk."

Sorry that I can't recommend any particular recorder. Standalone Video DVD recorders have always been small niche items, and have become obsolete as HDTV has replaced the SD broadcasting in most of the world. You didn't say where you are or what you record, but I'd likely use a DVR or a computer to record & store it myself. Both broadcasters and consumers are moving from media-based to file-based workflow.

Speed Daemon,

First and foremost, thank you for replying and for helping me out. I really do appreciate it.


Now, after reading your last post it occurs to me that I might be asking the wrong question. My question re: combo VCR/DVD recorders.

You see, I'm sad to report that I have about 150 VHS tapes of family reunions, vacations, family picnic etc, from 10 or more years ago. And naturally I want to preserve them. So I reckoned the best way would be to transfer the VHS tapes to DVDs.

But awwfter reading your last post I'm wondering if transferring the tapes straight to a DVR might be best? And if so, which moderately priced DVR should I be comparing?

Also, I'd like said DVR to have the capability to record pay-per-view movies that I rent from my cable company (Charter Cable) as is my right, IIRC, from my Mass Communication classes in college.

IIRC, according to FCC regulations, if you rent a movie from your cable company you're entitled to record it and watch it as many times as you like. But,(of course), the DVR that game with my cable package DOES NOT record movies you rent.

So my question is: is there a consumer DVR capable of recording rented movies, and is there a way I can transfer my old VHS tapes to it's hard drive?

And hopefully, the unit won't cost much more than $500 or less.


Any thoughts? Thanks in advance.



"Stick with me, baby, and you'll be fartin' thru silk."

Right now the state of the art with DVR technology is that they're best for recording live TV programs for playback fairly soon after the broadcast. It looks like you need something for archival purposes.

I too have a collection of VHS (and U-matic, Betacam etc.) tapes that I want to preserve. What I use is a Grass Valley Canopus ADVC110 to capture the NTSC signal from the various tape players to my computer, making a D-1 video file that's then compressed for storage, in my case on a RAID array.

I should say that I'm a long time TV broadcasting professional, so my methods are probably more involved than what you need. I've grown tired of keeping track of hundreds of optical discs, so I just keep them on a network file/video server that can stream the files' content to my TV. This is leading edge stuff, and may be too complex/costly for you.

If you're most comfortable with keeping your programs on optical discs, then you can use a computer (I'm guessing that you have one, since we're talking on the Internet) to capture the VHS tapes, and then make Video DVDs on your computer. Inexpensive capture devices from Pinnacle and StarTech can be found at the local big box store, though I would look for Hauppauge devices; I've had good results with that brand. DVD writers for computers are dirt cheap. Chances are that your computer already has one, but if not you can get one for next to nothing. Most of the capture devices come with software that will do an adequate job, and there is freeware on the Internet to choose from as well.

All told you can spend from $50 to $200 for all you need to do it with a computer. Maybe a bit more if you don't already have a good VHS player.

By buying the various components rather than having them all on one chassis, if one piece breaks down, you don't have to throw out the whole thing.

If you are growing tired of having lots of DVD discs, you can usually save the video as files, and buy an inexpensive HDD to store the files. I use RAID arrays so if any one HDD fails, I don't lose anything, but you can add reasonable protection by using 2 or more drives to store your video files.

What sort of computer do you have? Desktop? Laptop? PC or Mac? I could suggest a few setups if you like.


Also, I'd like said DVR to have the capability to record pay-per-view movies that I rent from my cable company (Charter Cable) as is my right, IIRC, from my Mass Communication classes in college.

IIRC, according to FCC regulations, if you rent a movie from your cable company you're entitled to record it and watch it as many times as you like. But,(of course), the DVR that game with my cable package DOES NOT record movies you rent.

So my question is: is there a consumer DVR capable of recording rented movies, and is there a way I can transfer my old VHS tapes to it's hard drive?
The terms of your contract with Charter are very long-winded and beyond the scope of this discussion. To make a long story short, any DVR that works with Charter has a "CCI flag" setting that limits your ability to copy the DRM content, be it PPV or from a premium channel. That has nothing to do with dubbing VHS recordings to digital media.

Now if any of these VHS tapes are movies with Macrovision copy protection, you will likely encounter problems trying to dub them using readily available equipment. In that case my advice is to buy the DVD (or Blu-ray) edition of the movie, and accept that you're not going to get a rebate because you have a VHS copy. Trying to defeat copy protection can open you up to lawsuits and possibly criminal charges, so it's better to stay away from piracy no matter what a college teacher said.

I've been using TiVo DVRs since they became available, and have a substantial investment in them. I also have software that allows me to take non-CCI video as files, and store them in my library. The last time I was on Charter, they made it very difficult to use my TiVo on their network. They would have preferred that I had rented their equipment, but since FCC rules say they must accommodate me nominally, they had to comply. But it wasn't easy.

Neither a TiVo nor a Charter supplied DVR will allow you to dub from VHS to them. Older non-HD TiVos had the ability to dub from VHS, but it was limited. I chose to use my computer because I found dubbing to a TiVo (years ago) was too cumbersome. You may find some no-name DVR that can dub old NTSC recordings, but I doubt that it will have a CableCard slot, so you'll never get it to work with Charter.

Sorry for the delay in replying

If you're most comfortable with keeping your programs on optical discs, then you can use a computer (I'm guessing that you have one, since we're talking on the Internet) to capture the VHS tapes, and then make Video DVDs on your computer. Inexpensive capture devices from Pinnacle and StarTech can be found at the local big box store, though I would look for Hauppauge devices; I've had good results with that brand. DVD writers for computers are dirt cheap. Chances are that your computer already has one, but if not you can get one for next to nothing. Most of the capture devices come with software that will do an adequate job, and there is freeware on the Internet to choose from as well.
Unfortunately what I now have is a $3200 door-stop. A power surge fried my desktop, and i've been planning to replace it with an all-in-one 24" DELL (quad core, 1TB, windows 10). I had been using our local library's computers, but today i'm on my phone.

And i've heard good things about Hauppauge devices, so that would be my first choice.


All told you can spend from $50 to $200 for all you need to do it with a computer. Maybe a bit more if you don't already have a good VHS player.
I see, and I assume what constitutes a "good" VHS player is not my ancient Panasonic consumer VCR from 15 years ago?

If not, could you recommend a nominally priced model--assuming that such a unit still exists.




Again, thanks in advance




"Stick with me, baby, and you'll be fartin' thru silk."

Also...


Now if any of these VHS tapes are movies with Macrovision copy protection, you will likely encounter problems trying to dub them using readily available equipment. In that case my advice is to buy the DVD (or Blu-ray) edition of the movie, and accept that you're not going to get a rebate because you have a VHS copy. Trying to defeat copy protection can open you up to lawsuits and possibly criminal charges, so it's better to stay away from piracy no matter what a college teacher said.
Not to worry--the tapes I have with movies were recorded legally off broadcast television way back in the early 90s, before I had any idea of what a DVR was. I have no designs on piracy.






"Stick with me, baby, and you'll be fartin' thru silk."

Unfortunately what I now have is a $3200 door-stop. A power surge fried my desktop, and i've been planning to replace it with an all-in-one 24" DELL (quad core, 1TB, windows 10). I had been using our local library's computers, but today i'm on my phone.
Ouch! Be sure to include the price of a good power protection system into the cost of your new system. Something with lots of copper inductors to soak up surge currents before they get to your computer. I've never had one fail when connected to a Tripp Lite Isobar.

Most "surge suppressors" use nothing but MOVs to take surges. The problem with MOVs is that they're not massive; they can't dissipate a significant event into heat without failing first. And every MOV fails after a certain number of hits. These days I use power management products made by Brickwall and Furman as my first line of defense, but still have 20-year-old Isobar boxes protecting the stuff that I can't spend $600 on for the more sophisticated power protection. I call my Isobar boxes "the poor man's Brickwall" because they work on the same principle:

http://www.brickwall.com/pages/how-it-works

Open up an Isobar and you'll see lots of small inductors, ganged so that each pair of outlets are isolated from the next pair, and so that the pair furthest from the power cord have more protection than the outlets closest to the cord.

Tom's Hardware tore one apart so you don't have to:

http://www.tomshardware.com/picturestory/684-tripp-lite-isobar-tear-down.html


And i've heard good things about Hauppauge devices, so that would be my first choice.
Same here. My first Hauppauge product was a very early ATSC tuner card that let me watch the HDTV testing in Chicago. It was hobbled by a crappy Windows device driver, and never got Linux support. Since then I've used lots of Hauppauge products with great success. I still carry a WinTV-HVR-955Q USB stick when I travel to record TV shows and (with special software) do site surveys for MATV installations. The USB-Live2 may be all you need to capture from a VHS deck.


I see, and I assume what constitutes a "good" VHS player is not my ancient Panasonic consumer VCR from 15 years ago?
That depends. I bought a top-of-the-line consumer VCR (with built-in TBC) specifically to use to dub my VHS tapes. I keep it boxed up so that dust doesn't collect when I'm not using it, and it's in like-new shape ~15 years later. I bought it, and keep it, mindful that it may be the last new VHS deck I might ever get.

OTOH there are plenty of used pro and prosumer VHS decks out there. The problem with buying used is that you're going to get a tired machine that has seen thousands of hours of use and abuse. How well it has been maintained or repaired can vary widely. If you have a good working relationship with a used pro video dealer, you could get lucky. Personally I didn't risk it, but it's certainly worth a look.

During my years in broadcast TV, using a time base corrector (TBC) to make the relatively unstable signal coming off the heads of a U-matic (same principle as VHS) deck suitable to broadcast was a necessity. No way around it there! So naturally I looked for one with a TBC built into it. I found it didn't matter for video capture. IME the capture device working with your computer does the same work as a TBC when digitizing the video. So if someone gives you the hard sell about pro gear and TBCs, take it with a grain of salt. Using a TBC adds one more A/D conversion and one D/A conversion, and those can actually make the picture worse.


If not, could you recommend a nominally priced model--assuming that such a unit still exists.
I don't think any new models are any good. That's why I bought mine 15 years ago, because I knew that they'd stop making high quality VHS decks as demand dried up. And that has already happened.

If your Panasonic is in good repair and has at least 4 heads (actually 6: 2 for SP, 2 for LP/EP and 2 for "Hi-Fi" audio, but they're often marked "4 head") and is in good repair, soldier on with it. You're always going to get the best picture from SP recordings and SP heads (cheaper "2-head" decks can use one pair of heads to read all tape speeds, but at reduced quality for SP), but if you recorded everything at the the slowest tape speed for maximum record time, it really doesn't matter.

I gotta go, but can you tell me the model of VCR you have?